Read this convo with Joe of New England Concerts & OIV in regards to Mark's showplace. I ask for us to be a comunity and boycott these fuckers.[views:30526][posts:238]_________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:21pm - sxealex ""] :whipper: |
| __________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:27pm - Dwellingsickness ""] Chantilly's in manchvegas never did p2p, And we had some really killer shows there, but when they were empty , they were really empty. |
| __________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:30pm - DaveFromTheGrave ""] guitar master said:I used to pay in a band called absoulte zero then colbalt casing. We played all around the east coast and had met some of the top people in the music scene by playing shows that we had to sell tickets for. I can honestly say It was the time of my life. We went from playing local shity dives to larger local dives and this is when we started selling tickets to our shows. We went from playing infront of 50- 100 people on a regular to 300-3,500 (depending on the venue and other bands). I know first hand that the promoters are not getting rich or taking advantage of the bands they book. A promoters job is to get as many people possible to a show and there best weapon for this is to have the bands promote themselves. It costs over $2000 dollars for radio adds and marketing tools. Where do you think the money comes from to promote a show at this scale? In todays market there is no more $50,000 record deals just given to a band for being a good musical group. Large record labels want to see you bringin a ton of people to shows as well as over all cd's sold. I agree with some of you about the art end of the musical spectrum but don't agree one bit with your cause to boycotte a club or bussiness just cause you can't do the work needed to bring a few hundred people out to the show. Mike you sound like a little kid with your insulsts of insecurity. Companies like the one pre mentioned above can truly help take a band from local status and make them national. vblah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah |
| __________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:31pm - timmy porphyria ""] >> ........I wouldn't be the least bit suprised if the venue made a million a million, ha ha. yeah that seems about right. pfft. |
| _______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:33pm - mike at zero ""] I know humiliation and modesty, i don't come one here saying how many people we play in front of or try to make what we love doing a competition. we have had our good shows and our bad shows, and always think we can do better and strive for it. we have shared the stage with many great young, old, all around talented bands, be them local or national. Call me a winer, a child, or whatever you will, but know one thing, I will always support our local seen, and want what local bands deserve. I understand that there is a system, like in most aspects of life that you have to work with, fair or unfair. And i said nothing about Oiv, not my thing, but made no insult. I remember the great days of the early 90's, when shows were booked by local band guys, and everyone shared a bit of the cash. we do this still at places like Milly's tavern in manch, a great venue, where you have control over the shows, the more you promote, the more you make, no middle man, and everyone gets a peice of the door. I can tell that you are friends or accaintences of Oiv by your anger and insults, and if you want to pay to play, that's your thing, I'm only exspressing my beliefs and anger on the issue, and ask for a sense of community that seems to be lacking these days. |
| ________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:38pm - DestroyYouAlot ""] I don't know - according to CSDO, the ultimate goal of music is to play with *ahem* "the nationals." Surely they know what it's all about, no? |
| _______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:39pm - mike at zero ""] We feel successful in the fact that we wrote, recorded, mixed and produced our own full lengths, to me that's success. |
| ____________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:43pm - anonymous ""] WHERE IS DWYER WHEN YOU NEED HIM? SEEN = SCENE!!!!!!!!! |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:45pm - sxealex ""] what constitutes a national act anyway... playing around the nation? |
| __________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:46pm - largefreakatzero ""] anonymous said:WHERE IS DWYER WHEN YOU NEED HIM? SEEN = SCENE!!!!!!!!! Haha -- I was thinking that too. Dwyer needs to have a sit-down with Mike to discuss spelling. |
| __________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:47pm - largefreakatzero ""] sxealex said:what constitutes a national act anyway... playing around the nation? Therefore, TOS was certainly a national act -- you guys played all over the place. |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:49pm - sxealex ""] yea and then serge at the bomb shelter was like comeback and you can play with a national act. and we were like ummmmmmmmm. wtf? are we in highschool? |
| ________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 4:53pm - DestroyYouAlot ""] Touring bands get no respect at home. FACT. |
| ______________________________ [Jul 25,2007 5:04pm - Lamp ""] Who the fuck would want to play shows to a few decent people and thousands of total losers anyway? Keep it small. |
| __________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 5:13pm - HCP Fan ""] DestroyYouAlot said:Touring bands get no respect at home. FACT. Ya unless they build up a large fan base at home first and stay true to their roots while they are gone. You must have never been on a real tour before. |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 5:16pm - sxealex ""] HCP... if you knew what you were talking about you would have tried to prove it by now. What do you think a real tour is??? |
| __________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 5:24pm - Dankill ""] There has GOT to be better places for bands to play then Mark's. And only holding 350? Come on! |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 5:27pm - sxealex ""] why dont we just make a metal/hc venue non-profit collective. then the promoter can make $ but require that its not pay to play or some other stupid gimmick. |
| ____________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 5:34pm - BornSoVile ""] You know what sucks more than Mark's doing business like this? Bands that do business like this. It's a real turn off for me to see bands actually value and trick themselves into thinking that their shit is awesome because they pay somebody to book them. Playing in front of 20 metal heads in Boston who know there shit > Playing in front of 200 retards at Marks who are only there cause "it's a wicked sick strip club". |
| ______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 5:59pm - fuckin dude ""] listen, i am too drunk to read the full thread... but i will say this i know one in vain personally, and they are a bunch of clowns ... haha their band is a joke.. that said, you should realize that you gotta bite the bullet sometimes and sell tix to play.. it sucks, but you will get there |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:03pm - sxealex ""] hahaha what? im so confused. |
| _______________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:05pm - Pires ""] Yeah, fuck pay to play clubs/shows...Never worth it...And Mark's sucks as a strip joint...You dont see any va-jay-jay! Although, Suffocation is coming back to Mark's... |
| ____________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:11pm - BornSoVile ""] I love it when all these world class musicians who havn't played south of CT think they know everything and resort to telling you, you have to man up to make in the biz cuz dats the way dis shit rolls son. |
| ___________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:12pm - my balls ""] Fuckin dude is talking out his ass That band is all about the fans and the music. I bet you have never even met them and if you did you were most likely a drunk ass and they wouldn't give you the time of day. I live in the same town as those guys and know for a fact they are chill guys just trying to go forward. Whats your real name you homo |
| ___________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:13pm - my balls ""] Don't be jealous cause they are talk about on waaf a few times a month for the kick ass shows they play |
| ____________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:17pm - inject-now ""] fuck marks showplace. fuck nu-metal bands that book marks. everything about that place sucks so much balls. |
| ____________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:17pm - BornSoVile ""] DUDE HILLMAN IS THE FUCKING SHIT! |
| ________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:29pm - DestroyYouAlot ""] HCP Fan said:DestroyYouAlot said:Touring bands get no respect at home. FACT. Ya unless they build up a large fan base at home first and stay true to their roots while they are gone. You must have never been on a real tour before. Sorry, dude, it's science. Back of the class for you. my balls said:Don't be jealous cause they are talk about on waaf a few times a month for the kick ass shows they play OMG AAF, D00D! MISTRESS CARRIE'S LEATHERY CLAM! WOOO!!! (BTW, you're an idiot.) |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:33pm - sxealex ""] its funny how when there is argument like this 1000 anon posters come in and argue with each other when they are probably the same guy. where is black metal lady? |
| ______________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:36pm - ArrowHead likes Pie ""] Bands nowadays already DO pay to play. Most bands around here have CD's they self-funded, as well as shirts, merch, vans, and thousands upon thousands of dollars in gear. When it comes to budgets for promotion, we spend ours on all of these things. We record the music, bust balls to play anywhere and everywhere to expose and sell it, and spread as much word of mouth promotion as we can. I don't think I've ever met a single kid in a band who didn't make me AWARE they were in a band withing the first ten minutes of meeting them. So since we already have our promotion spending cut out for us, it's always struck me as foolish for "promoters" to try and pass their own expenses on to us as well. Pay to play is not just some bullshit scam, it's in general a piss poor business model. Look at clubs like CBGB. (RIP). Build up a client base. Create a unique and interesting atmosphere. This is the entire point of a club hiring a "promoter". Live entertainment is only one manner of bringing in this client base, but to us musicians it's the only one that matters. We WANT your client base, so we can expose our music to them. If you insist on making your live acts the FOCUS of your club's draw, then your selection is smaller, your draw eventually will suffer, and you make little to no progress in creating this thriving club culture you want. Build good bills, and offer any and everything else you can to get people into your club. Now, build some strong and musically consistent bills to entertain these people. Expose new bands, discover unheard of talent that may eventually become a large draw, and try to procure some bands that are already established draws on every bill. Pay to play is a cheap excuse by promoters to guarantee a good draw or breaking even for a night. Instead of having to do the research, go to shows and see who will and will not make your old customers happy and bring in new ones as well, you just make the bands do all that legwork for you. Not only that, but with pay to play you can hold the BANDS responsible for a misjudged bill, or a poorly publicized event. I would much rather see more bars start doing "Pay to Promote". But in a contrary sidenote, I must mention that Mike at Zero loses ultimately on this one. He came across as a hot-headed asshole, thus justifying and misgivings this guy might have had against his band in the first place. In another sidenote, maybe you shouldn't be having the guy that cannot spell book your shows and write emails on your bands behalf? |
| __________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:37pm - Hcp Fan ""] Rev how much money do you make running this page? |
| ______________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:39pm - ArrowHead likes Pie ""] Hcp Fan said:Rev how much money do you make running this page? I'm pretty sure Rev SPENDS money running this page. It's a labor of love, not profit. |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:40pm - sxealex ""] FUCK ALL OF YOUsjk.dbflajk.akfg |
| __________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:41pm - Hcp Fan ""] thats what I wanted to know |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:41pm - sxealex ""] i think most of the money he spends is on gas |
| __________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:43pm - Hcp Fan ""] sxealex said:i think most of the money he spends is on gas What do you mean |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:45pm - sxealex ""] well it pretty obvious you dont have any interest in this site if you dont know all he does is drive around and take a billion awesome pictures of local shows. |
| ______________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:45pm - ArrowHead likes Pie ""] He goes to like 800 bajillion shows a week, all over new england. |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:46pm - sxealex ""] there are people that support the music scene and people that rape it. you HCP etc rape it. |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:47pm - sxealex ""] in other words in your head you hear "What can the music scene do for me". In my head I hear "what can I do for the music scene." |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 6:48pm - sxealex ""] not that i do too much or anything. just saying. |
| ______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:00pm - the_reverend ""] as long as this site is "packed" with banner ads, I break even on the site and lose A LOT each year to gas and camera gear/repair. "a lot" is even factoring in all the magazines and papers that pay me for pictures. "a lot" meaning around the price of a new car. |
| ______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:01pm - the_reverend ""] and that's yearly costs. ps: this convo is even funnier for me cause I see everyone's IPs. even people who may log out to post things. |
| ______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:12pm - BlackoutRick ""] Yeah, we haven't played their in over a year. |
| ______________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:18pm - ArrowHead likes Pie ""] the_reverend said: ps: this convo is even funnier for me cause I see everyone's IPs. even people who may log out to post things. You always say stuff like that, but you never expose people. I think it would be a lot funnier if you did. And Rev, when you say around the price of a new car you should factor in the price OF a new car, since I bet you log twice as many miles on your auto as any average person. |
| ______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:26pm - the_reverend ""] last year 50K. the cost of gas factors that in. |
| ______________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:29pm - the_reverend ""] and I'm for anonymous outlets of speech unless something in completely terrible. Just think of all the night-rapes that people on this board would have under their belts if the ladies and gentlemen had an anonymous forum to voice things they can't voice as themselves. anti-anonimity is a george bush thing, that faggot. |
| _________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:35pm - sxealex ""] not that it wasnt obvious anyway i suspect fuck dude and my balls are the same person. hence my comment. |
| ______________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 7:36pm - ArrowHead likes Pie ""] No, I'm pretty sure most people post here and then STILL go out at night to rape. |
| ________________________________________ [Jul 25,2007 8:05pm - DestroyYouAlot ""] the_reverend said:and I'm for anonymous outlets of speech unless something in completely terrible. Just think of all the night-rapes that people on this board would have under their belts if the ladies and gentlemen had an anonymous forum to voice things they can't voice as themselves. anti-anonimity is a george bush thing, that faggot. Hear, hear. Anonymous approves. |