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you are quoting a heck of a lot there.
[QUOTE]blah blah blah[/QUOTE] to reply to arkquimanthorn.
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[QUOTE="arkquimanthorn:1153792"][QUOTE="Yeti:1153774"]holy fuck. i like the writing about computers being "algorithmically deterministic" and can't reproduce human consciousness.[/QUOTE] "he argues that known laws of physics are inadequate to explain the phenomenon of consciousness." well of course a physicist would enjoy mathematically expressing consciousness. but my limited comp sci background says it's impossible. Godel's incompleteness theorem (math) when applied to the human mind as a system, basically says we can deduct a number of facts about the nature of consciousness, but cannot determine the nature of the system itself. or something like that. so, when you try to actually build a computer to mimic the human mind, you can make a number of projections and algorithms that reflect your PERCEPTION of how the mind works, but that's as close as you can get, the system itself will never be like the human mind. from a less theoretical standpoint: the basic component of any computer is it's clock. this determines everything it does and the frequency in which it does it. but in the inner workings of our consciousness, time becomes meaningless, because it is just a tool we use to measure. if you consider a cat to be essentially unconscious, because it responds to instincts and stimuli, and the special mammalian trait of remembering and recognizing danger and pleasure, rather than using logic, you could actually build a robot cat. you could make the argument that it's completely deterministic. human consciousness is more volatile and in a sense completely unpredictable, and while our unconscious directs and influences our newer consciousness, we have the power to deny it outright. you could use all the randomizing mechanisms you want in your "human computer" but it would never truly reflect consciousness. it's an interesting subject though. penrose is a true genius, but there's no need to make a new field of physics to explain consciousness. just read jung.[/QUOTE]
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